False administrivia bounce (who)...
----- Forwarded message from slug-politics@nks.net -----
From: Norbert Cartagena <niccademous@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [SLUG-POL] Alright, I'm here ...
To: slug-politics@nks.net
In-Reply-To: <3BB0897A.63F375D@ieee.org>
> I'm personally sick and tired of the "Liberals"
who
> think we are
> spending too much defense. People, we have
> seriously got to get our
> _priorities_straight_!
$310,000,000,000. This is the ammount we spend a year
on the military. A large portion of this is spent in
stationing and deffending prosperous friends who are
fully capable of deffending themselves from the
non-existent enemies (ie. why do we need to station so
many troops in Germany? France? England? Japan? Mind
you, were these to be attacked we _should_ and _would_
come to the deffense of these allies. However, we
spend how many BILLIONS stationing un-needed trops
there?). How about, say, DEFFENDING THE NATION instead
of the world?
One way to become a
> conservative is to
> _actually_look_at_the_budget_ from the 1960s
onward.
> Screw the TV
> media, _go_actually_look_at_the_ ~50 page summary
> sheets!
And you'll begin to notice that the major share of
taxation has turned from what it used to be (taxing
the wealthy and corporations - those that can afford
taxation - a very small ammount) to taxing the middle
class a dissproportionate ammount. Notice that even
during WW2, taxation for the middle class was
approximatelly 4%, where as the taxation for the upper
class was at 15% - both smaller ammounts than today.
Today, the situation has changed due to the ceation of
tax incentives/loopholes. Mind you, the wealthy often
think about this as "Tax advantages for economic
growth" whereas those who don't KNOW the tax system
think about it as "Welfare for the rich."
Nevertheless, the government policies that create
taxation in their original estimates don't COUNT on
these tax Incentives/Loop Holes (whichever side of the
fence you're on defines what word you use). If
anything, studying this history will make you an
econimic common-sensist - hardly a conservative.
> Defense spending, including advanced research, is
> well under 10%
> now. Missile defense (and I _dare_ you to
challenge
> me on this) is
> costing us peanuts -- plus it accounts for a
> crapload of DoD
> research going on (that benefit other markets).
And missle deffense would have helped us out here how?
It wouldn't have. As we notced, war is not now an
issue of bigger/better, it's an issue of
smaller/faster/better diguised. It has gone from the
Macro to the Micro (this is why information warfare is
now more important than ever). As such, preventative
methods are now the best - when not the only - line of
true defense. A small move done early does the job of
what a large move done later is supposed (and as we
see, failed) to do. In this case, better security at
the airport wouold have prevented this tragedy. This
is the result of private industry in deffense matters.
Selling security to the lowest bidder will give you
flawed results. And, as we know, Flawed security is
just as good as No security. This is why government
controled security at airports are not only a good
idea, but are a necessary step, and it takes that away
from the bottom line of airlines - good for the
market. How about spending the money on that instead
of wasting the money on what we KNOW to be a
non-working, flawed, spotty-success-at-best missle
deffense system, a monolithic and slow defense
mechanism - at about the same COST!! Why let the
hacker enter the network before you attack? Stop him
in his tracks BEFORE an attack occurs.
> If we're going to be a socialist country, let's
just
> go socialism
> I'm sick of this facist taxation system we have.
> And if you think
> "facist" is too strong of a word -- go look at
the
> various economic
> models. "Facism" is about government controlled
> private industry.
Fascism - noun.
A system of government marked by centralization of
authority under a dictator, stringent socioeconomic
controls, suppression of the
opposition through terror and censorship, and
typically a policy of belligerent nationalism and
racism.
Frankly that sounds like the Liberals, conservatives,
Moralist-right-wingers, and militant groups all rolled
into one. Yeah, Fascim is too strong of a term.
Socialist is more accurate. You might want to stick to
that, lest your credibility be put into question in
the name of fanaticism.
Socialism - noun
1) Any of various theories or systems of social
organization in which the means of producing and
distributing goods is owned collectively or by a
centralized government that often plans
and controls the economy.
2) The stage in Marxist-Leninist theory intermediate
between capitalism and communism, in which collective
ownership of the economy under the dictatorship of the
proletariat has not yet been successfully achieved.
I think that this first deffinition is PROBABLY what
you're looking for, with a tinge of the second.
> Right now, we do *NOT* have "privatized" health
> care, we have
> "facist" health care -- and Mr. Teddy K-boy came
up
> with the whole
> stupid HMO crap. HMOs were introduced to
influence
> people to adopt
> socialized health care.
Agreed. However, completely privatized health care
creates the same problem we have with privatized
security - the lowest bidder problem. Instead, this
too should be a govenrent service (in liu of the
institutionalized welfare system we currently have
that claims to provide health-care). Mind you, this
would NOT stop private industry from creating a
private health care system, but it would stop the
grossly innefficiet and abusive HMO system, which is
costing the government more than would cost a
completely nationalized health care system (compare
the percentage numbers with those of countris with
nationalized heath care, in relation to the size of
the national budget), and which also creates the
draconian problem of having business-types - who's
mind is in the "bottom line" - make life and death
medical decissions instead of doctors, whose first
obligatory duty is to the patient.
Anyways, I gotta go to work. Hope that this was enough
food for thought ;-)
Norb
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. . I'll be your server this evening.
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