[ Since my PC_Support list is on the LEAP server, and even the
re-created LEAP list seems to be down, I will post this here. Please
let me know if this is not appropriate content. ]
After looking through product specs, reviews and pricing over the last
few weeks, I have come to one conclusion, it's best to go either
i915/925 with PCI-Express (if you prefer Intel) or wait a month or so
for nForce4/KT890 chipset mainboards with PCI-Express (for AMD) for the
best, possible video performance for the price. This conclusion has
really nothing to do with PCI-Express itself, but the pricing around AGP
v. PCI-Express products given the following constraints.
1. Considering only nVidia cards and their Standardware GLX driver
2. Considering ATI's Standardware (GLX? DRI?) drivers "aren't there
yet" (getting close?)
There is no major performance difference between NV2x series
(GeForce3/4Ti -- but _not_ GeForce4MX, that's NV17, still the previous
gen GeForce2 equivalent) and NV3x series (GeForceFX), unless you pay
major $$$ for the latter like with a GeForceFX 5800/5900 series. The
popular "economy" GeForceFX 5700LE typically loses to the older NV25/28
(GeForce4 Ti4200-4800) with FSAA disabled, and can only possibly match
them with FSAA enabled.
At the same time, in the PCI-Express space, nVidia now offers a
multitude of native PCI-Express tiers in the new NV4x (GeForce 6x00)
series:
Sub-$100 GeForce 6200
Sub-$150 GeForce 6600
Sub-$200 GeForce 6600GT
The GeForce 6200 has been benchmarking in Windows just as good as the
top-end NV3x in the GeForceFX 5950 at many applications, OpenGL in
particular and more relevant to Linux. GeForce 6600/6600GT are even
more viable, including in Linux benchmarks, against any of the earlier
NV3x series -- especially those that cost much more.
Now nVidia has made the GeForce 6600GT available in an AGP, but
typically at a $40-50 premium. That's almost the cost of a new
mainboard. Plus there is the GeForce 6800LE, which is almost worth the
additional $40-50 premium. But then we're almost to $300, and back
where we started.
nVidia will not introduce an AGP GeForce 6200, at least not yet, because
it would compete with its well-selling NV34 GeForceFX 5200, even though
its slower than an older NV25/28 GeForce4 Ti4200-4800 at just about
everything (even with FSAA on -- sans maybe Doom3 with both 8x FSAA and
AAF on). And the GeForce 6600 isn't be offered for AGP either, probably
because it would compete with the GeForceFX 5700/LE, which still sells
well too.
Thus the NV4x series is limited to $225+ in the entire AGP space,
starting with the GeForce 6600GT AGP. That's the price of a new
mainboard and Athlon64 CPU right there! The NV3x dominates the lower
price AGP space, but sucks in price/performance compared to the NV4x.
Which brings me back to my original argument. If you're considering
upgrading your video card to cutting-edge, then it might be better to go
with a PCI-Express mainboard. Not because PCI-Express is better than
AGP, but because equivalent costing NV4x series nVidia cards for
PCI-Express perform much better than equivalent costing NV3x series
nVidia cards for AGP.
So unless you are going to spend $400 on a GeForce 6800GT DDR3 AGP, it's
probably much better to grab a new mainboard, CPU and GeForce 6600 or
even 6600GT for the same price -- getting 75-80% of just the CPU
performance. If you already have a Socket-754/939 CPU, then it's even
less! And for $100 less, you could get a GeForce 6200 and still get
within 60% of a 6800GT's performance -- waiting for the 6800GT to come
down in price over the next 9 months, when a better NV4x or a newer NV5x
hits. Because even if the new cards are not better performing, the
older cards will come down in price.
Just like the NV25/28 GeForce4 Ti series has. You can get a Ti4200/4800
64/128MB card for $60 these days, and it'll kick the crap out of a more
costly NV34 GeForceFX 5200 128/256MB at almost anything -- especially
older titles, but even at professional OpenGL. So unless you're going
to buy that $400 monster, it's better to just go PCI-Express with a new
mainboard.
Conclusions:
A) You got an old card, you want to upgrade, but save money:
- Buy a GeForce4 Ti4200/4800 instead of a GeForceFX 5200/5500
B) You got an old system, you want to upgrade:
- Buy a PCI-Express mainboard (if you go Socket-754/939 and have DDR
memory, you _can_ recycle it without issue!), new CPU (if necessary) and
GeForce 6200 (cost), 6600 (moderate performance), 6600GT (better
performance)
C) You've got a late model AGP mainboard/CPU, you want faster video
- Again, this gets tricky. If you want top-of-the-line video, then the
$400 GeForce 6800GT monster will do nicely. If you have an AMD Athlon64
already, especially on a Socket-754 mainboard, you might want to
consider a new Socket-939 mainboard with PCI-Express and a GeForce
6600GT which will probably be equivalent (and you can wait for a newer
video card to come down in price).
Remember, video cards double in performance _twice_ as fast as CPUs.
The most economical upgrade strategy is to upgrade your video card
_twice_ as often as your CPU. Because in the time a CPU is "two models
back," your video card is now "four models back." The typical, magical
price point is about $100-150 for "one model back."
Given the additional benefits of PCI-Express x1 channels (like for
storage, NIC, etc...), it is an added consideration. Especially since
there is such a major difference between "one model back" in GeForce
6200/6600 on PCI-Express and "several models back" in GeForceFX on AGP
for the same price.
Just some opinion of mine. Take it or leave it. I was looking at
replacing my wife's 30-month old GeForce Ti4400 128MB (cost me just over
$200 originally) with a GeForceFX 5700 or 5700LE, but either slower or
the same performance (maybe a little faster at Doom3). It would be much
better to spend my money on a GeForce 6600 or even a 6200, and taking
the savings paired with a little extra cash and just got Socket-939. I
can reuse her two DDR266/PC2100 DIMMs in it too. So I just need to wait
a month for the mainboards to come out.
And I'll still save on the overall cost versus something like a GeForce
6800GT, come within 80% of the performance, and can wait another 9-12
months for prices on those to come down, while still delivering her
about 50-100% more performance versus her Ti4400 (even more in Doom3).
-- Bryan J. Smith b.j.smith@ieee.org -------------------------------------------------------------------- Subtotal Cost of Ownership (SCO) for Windows being less than Linux Total Cost of Ownership (TCO) assumes experts for the former, costly retraining for the latter, omitted "software assurance" costs in compatible desktop OS/apps for the former, no free/legacy reuse for latter, and no basic security, patch or downtime comparison at all.----------------------------------------------------------------------- This list is provided as an unmoderated internet service by Networked Knowledge Systems (NKS). Views and opinions expressed in messages posted are those of the author and do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of NKS or any of its employees.
This archive was generated by hypermail 2.1.3 : Fri Aug 01 2014 - 20:17:46 EDT